Awkward conversation mark 2
Mar. 25th, 2009 02:29 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
sparkindarknessAs said here I was looking at the irrational and deeply silly issues some G&L people have towards our B&T brothers and sisters. Especially since it’s so damned STUPID to throw rocks at our natural allies and how it’s about time we got over this shit, closed ranks against those most unpleasant people who want us oppressed, repressed or just plain dead.
So let’s have an awkward conversation. Again, like the bisexual post, I’m probably going to get some stuff wrong, I’m probably going to accidentally offend people. I’ll try not to but if I do, I apologise in advance. Please slap me if I'm seriously off the rails and I'll do my utmost to correct it
Transexuals
The issues
Naturally first of all we have bigotry. I say this again - just because you are part of an oppressed group doesn’t mean you’re immune to being a bigoted arsehole. However we know that so moving on.
I think the main issue (beyond your bog-standard transphobia) is, again, a reaction to homophobia - lashing out but at a grossly inappropriate target.
Something that really bugs me as a gay man and probably every other gay person the world over. Some people treat me like a woman. Sooner or later nearly every gay person will be treated as someone of the opposite gender. Whether it’s assumptions, jokes, too-personal questions - gay men are considered sissy, sensitive, weak, feminine, female and often are assumed to want to be women, to be emulating women or trying to be women. This is even true in gay fiction where often one partner in a gay relationship is heavily feminised (and I KNOW you’re all tired of me ranting on that score :P). Similarly for lesbians they are considered butch, masculine etc etc.
In short, I have to, with tiring regularity, say that no, I’m not a woman, no I don’t want to be a woman, no I’m not trying to be a woman. I have to explain to the ignorant (“Which one of you is the woman in the relationship?”) and grit my teeth and deal with the insulting (“You’ve left your handbage behind, Tracy.”)
And after all this tiring and annoying and, yes, hurt, time spent saying “damn it I’m not a woman in a man’s body.” we then have a transsexual saying “I am a woman in a man’s body.” And there’s a foot stomp because you’re confusing the hetero-normative people and they’re going to make more assumptions about me *stomp feet, spit dummie out, throw all toys out of the pram.*
The next and, I think, lesser issue is the idea that transsexuals don’t belong under the GBLT umbrella. Homosexuality and bisexuality are about sexuality - who we’re attracted to and not while transgender is about gender identity. The argument is, the two are not the same so why are we under the same umbrella?
And extending from that there’s a sense some have that trannsexuals are riding on our coattails so to speak. Basically, while there are no end of bigots who are freaked by us gay folk, there are likely more and more severely freaked by the transsexual people. Is associating with transsexuals making homosexuals look even worse in the eyes of your die hard bigot? Is linking acceptance with homosexuality with acceptance of transsexuality making the fight more difficult or costly?
And why it’s so very very wrong
So some idiots give us shit about our gender identity? So they make unwarranted assumptions about us? So they make their damn idiot jokes? They insult and attack us? Since when was any of this the transsexual’s fault? It doesn’t matter if gender identity is a club the bigots love to smack us with - in the end they have plenty of other clubs and they’d use them if there were no transsexuals or a billion transsexuals. Is it depressing, hurtful and just plain annoying that we have to put up with this shit? Course it is - but place the blame where it is DESERVED and not on our fellow victims.
Are transsexuals part of the same umbrella as GBLs? Yes - if you look at the issue with anything but the most NARROW of definitions. In the end, people give us shit - all of us shit - because of narrowly defined gender roles and religious prohibition. If you look at the usual suspects who give GBLT folk (ALL of us) shit then it’s the same damn people the vast majority of the time. I don’t know of any group that says “I’m fine with trans people but you homos have got to go.” And while there are a few that go the other way, the chances are if someone is rapidly furious about transsexuals then gay people are not top of their fanlist either. The same arguments used against transsexuals (it’s not natural/what my deity intended blah blah blah) are the same ignorant and stupid arguments that are used against gay folks.
We want the same things - (equality, respect, not to be screwed over more than your average person is). We have the same principles (proud of who we are, unwillingness to hide, to be who we know we are rather than what society demands we be) We have the same enemies. They use the same language to attack us. We’re on the same side. We’re fighting the same fight and there most certainly should be a T in the GBLT movement.
Which brings us to the idea of transsexuals latching onto, diluting or dragging down the gay rights movement (or homosexual agenda if you want to freak out the crazies. And you know you do. C’mon, it’s fun.). Well again, same fight, same issues, same enemy. It’s not diluting resources when we’re saying the same thing, hitting the same targets and struggling against the same opposition. You don’t dilute or misdirect a movement by adding more people moving in the same direction.
And lastly - would it be easier if gay people dumped the transsexuals and just campaigned for homosexuals? I don’t know, probably not I think (same sissues, same enemies etc etc). It’s a moot point anyway - I mean would it be easier for lesbians to gain more acceptance if they dropped us gay men? (Personally i don’t buy that trope that lesbians get less shit than gay men, our sisters get waaay more than their share of shit - but you get the idea). Or how about we drop the drag queens? How about we drop everyone who isn’t middle class, reserved and fits gender stereotypes as utterly closely as possible? Or maybe every member of queerdom who doesn’t cower on their knees apologising to the bigots for being naughty sinful homos?
Because if you’re going to start dropping people because they may freak out the bigots slightly more than you do then it’s not going to end and we’ve LOST. If you’re going to play the “I’m a good homosexual, they’re the bad ones!” card them GTFO, tbh. Because you’re a bloody collaborator with the bigots and we don’t need it. You’re VALIDATING they’re hate. You’re encouraging it. You’re accepting it, you‘re saying it‘s reasonable, right, even good. And you need to cut that shit out RIGHT NOW!
Stand with your brother’s and sister’s together so we can get some justice, some respect, some tolerance, some acceptance and basic human dignity or get the hell away from us.
Sparky’s guide to not giving trans people shit
Again, just because the homophobes treat us like shit, doesn’t mean we’re excused treating transsexuals like shit. They’d treat us like shit anyway, it’s not the transsexual’s fault. Place the blame where it’s deserved
Don’t tell them their identity. Accept their own self-identification - arguing about their identity is as annoying or more as when straight people tell us we’re not really gay.
Don’t use pejorative terms. Not even in fun. Yes, I know you use gay slurs among gay folks and we CAN because that’s reclaiming. You’re not transsexual. You can’t reclaim those words. Don’t use tranny, Mister-sister or any of the other crap people have used. Not even if some transsexuals say you can. If you’re told a term is offensive, apologise and stop using it. Don’t argue.
Make our spaces friendly. We all know how utterly WONDERFUL it is to go into a gay club or gay society or even a gay pride parade and have that wonderful “AHHH” relax feeling knowing that this is our space and we’re safe to BE here. Hetero-normative society has made most of the world as unfriendly to transsexuals as it has for us. Let the transsexuals feels safe in our space. Let it be their space as well.
Include transsexual issues on our agenda. Give space and time to their issues. Make sure your GBLT movements give more than a passing nod to our T brothers and sisters. We’re in this together, let them be a part of it
Don’t accept prejudice shit from other GBLs just because they’re GBLs - call them on it. Grab the haddock and slap them hard.
Don’t do shit to them that annoy you when straights do it to us. Are you asking personal questions of a complete stranger? Are you making ridiculous assumptions? Are you applying stereotypes? Are you treating them as a walking avatar of transsexuality rather than a person? Are you making tasteless jokes? Well that shit annoys us so why do you think it wouldn’t annoy them?
So let’s have an awkward conversation. Again, like the bisexual post, I’m probably going to get some stuff wrong, I’m probably going to accidentally offend people. I’ll try not to but if I do, I apologise in advance. Please slap me if I'm seriously off the rails and I'll do my utmost to correct it
Transexuals
The issues
Naturally first of all we have bigotry. I say this again - just because you are part of an oppressed group doesn’t mean you’re immune to being a bigoted arsehole. However we know that so moving on.
I think the main issue (beyond your bog-standard transphobia) is, again, a reaction to homophobia - lashing out but at a grossly inappropriate target.
Something that really bugs me as a gay man and probably every other gay person the world over. Some people treat me like a woman. Sooner or later nearly every gay person will be treated as someone of the opposite gender. Whether it’s assumptions, jokes, too-personal questions - gay men are considered sissy, sensitive, weak, feminine, female and often are assumed to want to be women, to be emulating women or trying to be women. This is even true in gay fiction where often one partner in a gay relationship is heavily feminised (and I KNOW you’re all tired of me ranting on that score :P). Similarly for lesbians they are considered butch, masculine etc etc.
In short, I have to, with tiring regularity, say that no, I’m not a woman, no I don’t want to be a woman, no I’m not trying to be a woman. I have to explain to the ignorant (“Which one of you is the woman in the relationship?”) and grit my teeth and deal with the insulting (“You’ve left your handbage behind, Tracy.”)
And after all this tiring and annoying and, yes, hurt, time spent saying “damn it I’m not a woman in a man’s body.” we then have a transsexual saying “I am a woman in a man’s body.” And there’s a foot stomp because you’re confusing the hetero-normative people and they’re going to make more assumptions about me *stomp feet, spit dummie out, throw all toys out of the pram.*
The next and, I think, lesser issue is the idea that transsexuals don’t belong under the GBLT umbrella. Homosexuality and bisexuality are about sexuality - who we’re attracted to and not while transgender is about gender identity. The argument is, the two are not the same so why are we under the same umbrella?
And extending from that there’s a sense some have that trannsexuals are riding on our coattails so to speak. Basically, while there are no end of bigots who are freaked by us gay folk, there are likely more and more severely freaked by the transsexual people. Is associating with transsexuals making homosexuals look even worse in the eyes of your die hard bigot? Is linking acceptance with homosexuality with acceptance of transsexuality making the fight more difficult or costly?
And why it’s so very very wrong
So some idiots give us shit about our gender identity? So they make unwarranted assumptions about us? So they make their damn idiot jokes? They insult and attack us? Since when was any of this the transsexual’s fault? It doesn’t matter if gender identity is a club the bigots love to smack us with - in the end they have plenty of other clubs and they’d use them if there were no transsexuals or a billion transsexuals. Is it depressing, hurtful and just plain annoying that we have to put up with this shit? Course it is - but place the blame where it is DESERVED and not on our fellow victims.
Are transsexuals part of the same umbrella as GBLs? Yes - if you look at the issue with anything but the most NARROW of definitions. In the end, people give us shit - all of us shit - because of narrowly defined gender roles and religious prohibition. If you look at the usual suspects who give GBLT folk (ALL of us) shit then it’s the same damn people the vast majority of the time. I don’t know of any group that says “I’m fine with trans people but you homos have got to go.” And while there are a few that go the other way, the chances are if someone is rapidly furious about transsexuals then gay people are not top of their fanlist either. The same arguments used against transsexuals (it’s not natural/what my deity intended blah blah blah) are the same ignorant and stupid arguments that are used against gay folks.
We want the same things - (equality, respect, not to be screwed over more than your average person is). We have the same principles (proud of who we are, unwillingness to hide, to be who we know we are rather than what society demands we be) We have the same enemies. They use the same language to attack us. We’re on the same side. We’re fighting the same fight and there most certainly should be a T in the GBLT movement.
Which brings us to the idea of transsexuals latching onto, diluting or dragging down the gay rights movement (or homosexual agenda if you want to freak out the crazies. And you know you do. C’mon, it’s fun.). Well again, same fight, same issues, same enemy. It’s not diluting resources when we’re saying the same thing, hitting the same targets and struggling against the same opposition. You don’t dilute or misdirect a movement by adding more people moving in the same direction.
And lastly - would it be easier if gay people dumped the transsexuals and just campaigned for homosexuals? I don’t know, probably not I think (same sissues, same enemies etc etc). It’s a moot point anyway - I mean would it be easier for lesbians to gain more acceptance if they dropped us gay men? (Personally i don’t buy that trope that lesbians get less shit than gay men, our sisters get waaay more than their share of shit - but you get the idea). Or how about we drop the drag queens? How about we drop everyone who isn’t middle class, reserved and fits gender stereotypes as utterly closely as possible? Or maybe every member of queerdom who doesn’t cower on their knees apologising to the bigots for being naughty sinful homos?
Because if you’re going to start dropping people because they may freak out the bigots slightly more than you do then it’s not going to end and we’ve LOST. If you’re going to play the “I’m a good homosexual, they’re the bad ones!” card them GTFO, tbh. Because you’re a bloody collaborator with the bigots and we don’t need it. You’re VALIDATING they’re hate. You’re encouraging it. You’re accepting it, you‘re saying it‘s reasonable, right, even good. And you need to cut that shit out RIGHT NOW!
Stand with your brother’s and sister’s together so we can get some justice, some respect, some tolerance, some acceptance and basic human dignity or get the hell away from us.
Sparky’s guide to not giving trans people shit
Again, just because the homophobes treat us like shit, doesn’t mean we’re excused treating transsexuals like shit. They’d treat us like shit anyway, it’s not the transsexual’s fault. Place the blame where it’s deserved
Don’t tell them their identity. Accept their own self-identification - arguing about their identity is as annoying or more as when straight people tell us we’re not really gay.
Don’t use pejorative terms. Not even in fun. Yes, I know you use gay slurs among gay folks and we CAN because that’s reclaiming. You’re not transsexual. You can’t reclaim those words. Don’t use tranny, Mister-sister or any of the other crap people have used. Not even if some transsexuals say you can. If you’re told a term is offensive, apologise and stop using it. Don’t argue.
Make our spaces friendly. We all know how utterly WONDERFUL it is to go into a gay club or gay society or even a gay pride parade and have that wonderful “AHHH” relax feeling knowing that this is our space and we’re safe to BE here. Hetero-normative society has made most of the world as unfriendly to transsexuals as it has for us. Let the transsexuals feels safe in our space. Let it be their space as well.
Include transsexual issues on our agenda. Give space and time to their issues. Make sure your GBLT movements give more than a passing nod to our T brothers and sisters. We’re in this together, let them be a part of it
Don’t accept prejudice shit from other GBLs just because they’re GBLs - call them on it. Grab the haddock and slap them hard.
Don’t do shit to them that annoy you when straights do it to us. Are you asking personal questions of a complete stranger? Are you making ridiculous assumptions? Are you applying stereotypes? Are you treating them as a walking avatar of transsexuality rather than a person? Are you making tasteless jokes? Well that shit annoys us so why do you think it wouldn’t annoy them?