This? THIS disgust beyond words!

[sparkindarkness]

http://ukpress.google.com/article/ALeqM5htQjSre-hYFZBuou5srqd2HJxgVA

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/7556958.stm

NO this woman did NOT contribute towards her own rape - no matter if she had been sucking up an entire brewery's contents. I don't care if she was PARALYTIC in the gutter. SHE DID NOT CONTRIBUTE TO HER OWN RAPE

She was sexually assaulted. She was raped. Someone forced sex on her that she did not want. This man assaulted her - and NOTHING she did can change that. NOTHING she did, NO state she was in in any way encourages, influences or otherwise causes a man to sexually assault a woman. That's ENTIRELY in his court, his responsibility, his doing. She never asked to be raped. She never causes her rape. She never encourages her rapist to rape. She never brings rape upon herself. No matter how VULNERABLE she is to rape it is never ever her fault or her responsibility because she was targetted.

A WOMAN CAN NEVER BE RESPONSIBLE FOR HER OWN RAPE. Even implying that she can be even in part be responsible for it is utterly without merit and revoltingly inexcusable.

Comments

[bladespark.livejournal.com]

That's pretty sick. Ugh.

(Though I DO personally differentiate between "I was so drunk I said yes and I didn't actually mean yes" and "raped while under the influence." And I really dislike it when somebody calls the first one rape. That's accusing a guy who thought he was having consentual sex with a crime he probably would never dream of committing.)

[polarbee.livejournal.com]

I think the problem comes in differentiating those two situations after the fact as a third party.

[bladespark.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I know it's a very gray area, really. But it just makes me squirm inside thinking that a girl would happily destroy a guy's life (because that's what happens when you're accused of rape, no matter how it turns out, people will think of you forever as a rapist) just because she decided when she sobered up that she didn't want to do that after all.

[ladydyani.livejournal.com]

I know a woman who did that. It was the morning after, so she had a hangover but she wasn't drunk, and she said he took advantage of her and claimed it was rape.

He was military. She very nearly ruined his career.

[sparkindarkness.livejournal.com]

There is a huge difference but the latter happens a loit less often than people would have us believe (I think it is an element of societal misogyny that there is this assumption that a woman reporting a rape is lying - I mean, it happens so often and is so prevalent).

The sad fact is that most rapes are very he said/she said affairs so the chance of ANY rape resulting in conviction are slim. So a false accusation is highly unlikely to result in a conviction - though the accusation can be a problem in itself.

[jerril]

I think the guy should probably feel nasty for taking a woman who's utterly shitfaced seriously when she says much of anything, because dude, she's totally drunk and it's KIND of hard not to notice that... but agreement that the two shouldn't be confused.

[snuck.livejournal.com]

Coincidentally I was chatting to my sister in law last night - she is an educator with the sexual assault referral centre.

Apparently these days they are trying to teach the kids the differences between "ready", "willing" and "able" - in explaining consent rules.

I like the way they distinguish the three parts of consent ...

[sparkindarkness.livejournal.com]

Agreed - I like that they teach it and I am beyond utterly depressed that it has to be taught

[mrmeval.livejournal.com]

The last prediction I've read in science fiction has come true.

[sparkindarkness.livejournal.com]

That people are stupid? Damn that's been happening for a hella long time!

[mrmeval.livejournal.com]

Michael Z. Williamson had a view of earth that was depressing in "Freehold".
Free here: http://www.webscription.net/p-162-freehold.aspx
Nah he's a capitalist he just gives it away free samples like a crack dealer. ;)

[gwailowrite.livejournal.com]

This shit infuriates me, but does not surprise me in the least. I watched a trial where a grown man was testifying about how when he was 12, he had been sexually assaulted by a 40 year old. The lawyers use the ploy with him as well but in the "Well, you didn't say no, so you really, really wanted it, didn't you."

I'm sorry, but rape cannot (and should not) ever be qualified. And the whole prosecution of the victim still goes on and on and on.

Argh!

[sparkindarkness.livejournal.com]

Oh i've seen the full line up. From tracking out the accused sexual history to make it clear that OMG SINCE SHE'S NOT A VIRGIN SHE MUST HAVE WANTED IT! to the idea that because they consented for sex once then they are assumed to always consent (I have bought you woman! You will now be my sex dispensor!) gah

And it's so hard a case to prosecute/defend from a legal stand point. You've 90% of the time got the word of one person against another and little other supporting evidence. It inevitably becomes a battle of character - which is an awful, dirty, disgusting battle

[thisdaydreamer.livejournal.com]

That is horrifying. So, if a woman goes to a bar and has a couple of pints, she's worth less than a teetotaler? Or are they saying that no sorta, kinda means yes if the woman has had a glass of wine?

What the hell?

On the other hand, the government pays victims of crime there? Really? Here, a rape victim may get counseling and a lock change. Oh, and I don't think there is a charge for the investigation. A lot of the medical treatment would come with a charge, but insurance would pay that, if the victim has it. Or, maybe, if the guy is ever caught, she could sue for damages. She would have to remember that her personal and sexual history can be used as evidence in civil court.

Why, no, we don't have a great track record for rape being reported, and we have a worse record for rape prosecution in this country. How did you guess?

[sparkindarkness.livejournal.com]

Not only worth less but she somehow causes her own rape. A woman is apparently encouraging rape if she dares be anything less than stone cold sober.

Anyone who is a victim of crime can receive a (relatively paltry) recompense, yes. Especially violent crime (and if money is unlikely to be recouped from the person who committed the crime) as an aid to help a victim get back on track with their own life.

Medical treatement payment is moot because of the NHS :)

Prosecuting rape is nigh impossible - in some ways I sympathise with the difficulties because it's usually one word against another - but the authorities need to make it as easy as possible to report a rape

[suryaofvulcan.livejournal.com]

No-one, man or woman, is ever responsible for their own rape (just to be clear, because men are raped too, and the reporting rate for that is even lower than that for male on female rape).

However, alcohol can be a huge factor in a man believing he has consent when in fact he hasn't, or as someone said above, a woman actually giving consent and then regretting it once she (or maybe both of them) sobers up.

The reports I heard on the radio said this was a 'stranger rape' but didn't give more detail for fear of identifying the woman, so we don't know whether this was someone who attacked her in the street (as most commenters seem to have assumed) or someone she met that night in a bar, felt up in the taxi on the way home, and who perhaps believed he had consent.

Alcohol impairs good judgement - for both parties. Where sex is involved it lowers inhibitions, and that can have devastating results - for both parties. Therefore GETTING DRUNK IS NEVER A GOOD IDEA.

[sparkindarkness.livejournal.com]

Male rape is one of the ultimate hidden crimes. Gods forgive us from producing a culture that makes people ashamed of being attacked

Form what I understand in this case her drunk was spiked which pretty much leaves little doubt in the matter

[suryaofvulcan.livejournal.com]

That assumes her drink was spiked by the same person who raped her, and with that intention - but that's actuaqlly a pretty big assumption.

I've had drinks 'spiked' by well-meaning friends who bought me doubles instead of single measures (and in Scotland, that meant 70ml of spirits per drink, nearly 3 times the strength of an English single 25ml measure). Their intention was simply to get me drunk to celebrate passing my exams. Luckily they were also sensible enough to escort me home, but if they'd left me in the pub with my head down the toilet I dread to think what might have happened. I get very amourous when I'm pissed, and someone could easily have taken advantage of that.

[amynnah.livejournal.com]

I was talking to one of my (former) roommates about male rape... evidently, according to US courts (/rolls eyes), male rape is nonexistent, because, as defined by the courts, rape is penetration of the vagina.

...

She and I both believe we need that shit changed, but with how backwards the US is... ::sighs:: If a man is forced against his will, that's still rape. He's still as violated as a woman.

...and this is why I would love to get an insertable quisinart for my junk. /generic angryface.

::loves on Spark::

[ladyhelen.livejournal.com]

This makes me so fucking angry. Yes, getting that drunk is never a good idea - but nobody is *ever* responsible in any measure for their own rape. Ever.

[sparkindarkness.livejournal.com]

Agreed so much. Just ebcause she is drunk doesn't mean she deserves to be a victim

[fasangel.livejournal.com]

She gets her drink spiked, and then is in trouble for having been drinking? That isn't a case of diminished capacity due to alcohol, that is diminished capacity due to being drugged so that she would be easier to control. But no, it is all her fault for having been in a situation with the evil of alcohol anywhere near her. Remind me, is alcohol legal where she lives? Or is it only allowed for the big brave menfolk?

Have to stop thinking about this before I start breaking furniture. I need my furniture.

[sparkindarkness.livejournal.com]

Because she should be a pure teetotaler or she is a less than pure example of pristine womanhood, y'know *eye roll*

[ephemera.livejournal.com]

Amen. Just ... yeah. Amen.